Need knowledgeable mechanic - bike won't move in any gear

[island boyeee]

Hello all,

I just got this problem yesterday on my last lap of the last session of the day (how lucky). I never noticed any slipping, but I was in 4th gear rolling on for the straight and all of a sudden I had nothing. The bike clicks into every gear like it normally would, but revs like it's in neutral.

Tried loosening the clutch cable to see if it would grab, still nothing. Going to completely disconnect it later and see if it grabs at all. Either way, I'll be pulling the case off to see what's going on.

Any knowledgeable input on this? If it was just the clutch, I would think I would've noticed something before it completely went.

Next track weekend is in 3 weeks... really hoping to have this squared away sooner than that.

Thanks!

-Ian-

[Kurlon]

What does the clutch cable feel like, can you feel it working against the springs, or is it all dead fish no feedback?

[Jim]

i know you changed your oil for this event, but how's the oil level now?

does your bike have a stock slipper?
if so, have you checked/adjusted the slip level?

[Tekime]

Check your front sprocket/countershaft, is it spinning?

You still have a chain on it right?

[Pigman]

Yea.....make sure the front sprocket bolt is on and isnt spinning....happend to a guy I work with on his R6. Weird but i was also suprised it was that.

[island boyeee]

What does the clutch cable feel like, can you feel it working against the springs, or is it all dead fish no feedback?

Cable feels exactly the same. However, I had adjusted it at the last track day, I noticed I had to release some tension (this was sign #1 the clutch may be going). Yesterday when I was trying to figure out what happened, I released all the tension on the adjuster by the lever up top, and the cable is still tight. So, possible the clutch wore a good bit more?

i know you changed your oil for this event, but how's the oil level now?

does your bike have a stock slipper?
if so, have you checked/adjusted the slip level?

Oil is still fine, nothing in the belly pan and didn't see any leaks. No slipper clutch. All natural baby.

Check your front sprocket/countershaft, is it spinning?

You still have a chain on it right?

Haha the first thing I did while coasting into the pits was look down at the chain. It's still on.

Shit, that's a good point about the front sprocket. I'll pop that cover off and check it out before I remove the clutch cover. Thanks! Really hope I don't have to replace that... (assuming it's more difficult than replacing the clutch).

[Kurlon]

Cable feels exactly the same. However, I had adjusted it at the last track day, I noticed I had to release some tension (this was sign #1 the clutch may be going). Yesterday when I was trying to figure out what happened, I released all the tension on the adjuster by the lever up top, and the cable is still tight. So, possible the clutch wore a good bit more?

That's not normal... you need to pop the clutch cover off, and then the pressure plate. My concern is a retaining nut has come undone allowing the hub to migrate forward further than normal.

[island boyeee]

That's not normal... you need to pop the clutch cover off, and then the pressure plate. My concern is a retaining nut has come undone allowing the hub to migrate forward further than normal.

Hmm... I'm not exactly sure what that means. But it sounds like something that would be obvious when I take the cover off?

[Stromper]

There is a rare deal where the top metal plate jams open like its cocked on the basket and holds the clutch open

Most bikes you can see the clutch stack through the oil filler, see if its moving and clamping
Tap it with a medium ball peen then threaten it with a hand sledge.... it will stop fooling around

[island boyeee]

I was going to look in there as well. You can see the plates through the filler hole. Thank you.

Heading home now to get the bike off the trailer and start digging. I shall return...


I also started looking at slipper clutches (I can't afford) and found out that I can use the one from the '13 675R if I buy the same year basket, plates, and some other small stuff like springs and bolts. If I have to buy all the plates anyway, it may be a worthwhile investment.

[Kurlon]

Jammed plate should result in a cable with more slack than normal.

[island boyeee]

Well, I found my problem... Kudos to those that guessed right, and thanks to everyone else for the help so far.

I had found a huge nut in my belly pan after the last track day and couldn't figure out what it came from. I guess it was stupid to assume someone put it there as a joke or it somehow found its way in there. Now I know.

Unfortunately this is probably worse than the clutch, because I imagine this shaft is way worse to replace. The threads are ground off from the sprocket riding on it.

Gonna start researching, but if anyone has the rough steps I'd love to know what I'm looking at. If it's very involved, would it be worth threading it for a smaller nut.

Or... Sliding on something like a huge washer and drilling a hole in the shaft for a bolt or some safety wire to hold it on? Just to get through this season.




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[island boyeee]

Actually upon further inspection, only the inner couple threads are worn out. Looks like I could still seat the nut on there pretty well. Not sure.


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[golden chicken]

I say it can't hurt to try.

[island boyeee]

I think a new washer and a bunch of loctite and I'll be good for this season, deal with it this winter, along with the clutch.


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[PeaPod]

Why all the red dust? Your chain rusting out?

[carsick]

Tekime scores on the WTF is wrong with my bike bingo! That nut looks to be on backwards. Recess faces the sprocket. I'd highly advise a new front sprocket, nut, and locking tab washer. How do the splines look on the inside of that sprocket? Torquing to spec will help too. And yeah, treat yourself to some chain lube.

[Tekime]

You got lucky, all things considered.

I'd inspect that chain closely too - the outer rollers will shatter and the lubricant dries out leaving that red dust everywhere. Hard to tell because the inner bushing (4) looks just like the roller (5) except it's smaller. But eventually can lead to total failure. If you're at the end of your chain adjustment that's a pretty good indication too.

At least that's what I've seen. Could just be rust, but that red dust is a familiar sight. Keep her lubed in the meantime.

[Kurlon]

Unless the sprocket was not seated, that won't explain your symptom set.

[island boyeee]

I'm not sure, honestly, but sounds like you guys know lol. I'm (almost) always on top of cleaning and lubing the chain regularly. Currently, needs a clean. I wasn't aware it could be rusting "internally." I've had the same chain and front sprocket since I bought the bike almost 6 years ago . But I'm going to get a new chain and front sprocket anyway. Debating going back to stock size from -1... Would like a little more top end after maxing out at ~145 this weekend. But the splines are fine, it fit snuggley back onto the shaft.

I just threw the nut on to check the threads, I couldn't remember which way it went. Thank you for clarifying. But the threads in it are totally fine, don't see a reason for a new one. I'm definitely ordering a new washer. I pounded that one flat and threw it on, again for test fitting.

Thank you guys once again for some great info. Didn't get to look into shaft replacement procedure tonight, I'll save that for another day.


I haven't had to ask for mechanical help in a long time, feels weird and nooby. Great to know there are still plenty of useful and knowledgeable people out there. Well, mainly just on this forum

[island boyeee]

Unless the sprocket was not seated, that won't explain your symptom set.

sorry, I didn't take a picutre until after I had put the sprocket back on the splines. It was sitting on the inner part of the threads.

It works as it should now.

[PeaPod]

[QUOTE=Tekime;1468188] Could just be rust, but that red dust is a familiar sight. Keep her lubed in the meantime.

My understanding, and correct me if I am wrong, is that the lubricant inside the rollers has gone past the o-ring seals, water has got inside, and the inner roller is rusting. So the chain may look fine from the outside, but the inside is what is rusting away, as the o-rings are supposed to hold the lubricant in. The red dust is just finely ground rust which has been expelled. No amount of lube is going to take care of the issue, a new chain is in order. Lubing the chain is really just for the sprocket/outer rollers to reduce friction and keep the o-rings pliable.

[island boyeee]

Makes sense to me. I have seen several of the o-rings are torn and hanging off. It'll all be on order tomorrow.

[Tekime]

My understanding, and correct me if I am wrong, is that the lubricant inside the rollers has gone past the o-ring seals, water has got inside, and the inner roller is rusting. So the chain may look fine from the outside, but the inside is what is rusting away, as the o-rings are supposed to hold the lubricant in. The red dust is just finely ground rust which has been expelled. No amount of lube is going to take care of the issue, a new chain is in order. Lubing the chain is really just for the sprocket/outer rollers to reduce friction and keep the o-rings pliable.

Yeah, definitely a new chain asap! This could very well be true. Got the red dust on my GS and had broken rollers. For some reason it just looked... weird for rust. I was dumb and rode it for a while waiting for the new chain, then found a nice collection of split rollers chilling in the sprocket cover.

[island boyeee]

Yeah I didn't pin that as rust. Good to know for sure.