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Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

  1. #326
    Soul Rider Paul_E_D's Avatar
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    I dunno? He's an insanely fast trackrider. Wanted something tame for woods, then thought it was too tame I guess.

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  2. #327
    Lifer typeone's Avatar
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    ah, got it. doubt he'll have it long. hope he can score an RR. my neighbor has the hots now too anyone looking for a MINT CR250R with 265 BB kit and the works?

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    Beta 200RR

  3. #328
    Lifer Imbeek's Avatar
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    Quote Originally Posted by typeone View Post
    ah, got it. doubt he'll have it long. hope he can score an RR. my neighbor has the hots now too anyone looking for a MINT CR250R with 265 BB kit and the works?
    What year and how much

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  4. #329
    Lifer typeone's Avatar
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    Quote Originally Posted by Imbeek View Post
    What year and how much
    2002 and i will ask.

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    Beta 200RR

  5. #330
    Don't bother me! R7's Avatar
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul_E_D View Post
    Anybody need an Xtrainer? My buddy bought one and is already selling it. Hahaa. 50 miles. like new.
    I may know someone interested, pm me what he's asking for it

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  6. #331
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    I have the Xtrainer for sale. I wanted it because a few years ago I crushed my L1 vertabre on a my ktm and gave up dirt riding. I wanted to get back into the woods and figured that I would be into more technical rock climbs etc and that this Xtrainer would be the perfect bike for me to do that and the speeds would be lower. On my first ride I was with my riding buddy from the past and in no time we were getting back into the fast harescramble type riding and this bike is not made for it. I thought about trying to swap out the forks and shock but that may not get me where I want to be. I did want to slow down but now that I've had a taste , I still have the desire for the fast stuff. So rather than try to make the bike something its not I need to move on. Unfortunately it will come at a price. Don't let this discourage anyone from this bike, it is awesome for its intended use, it climbs knarly rock infested slipery stuff better than anything I have ridden. I'm open to reasonble offers. It is a sold out model that is basically new.....

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  7. #332
    Lifer
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    Scotty let me tool around the yard on his pretty eyetalian princess this weekend. Not really a fair comparison for so many reasons as I am an inexperienced noob, tooling around a yard is only a very small part of all this, and I was pretty spent at that point in the day.

    But gosh, the XT sure is a nifty motorbike.

    VS my modified 2012 200 XC-W:
    These bikes seem really similar. Weight *feels* almost identical. (Specs say my 200 is lighter by about 10-15 lbs.) E-start is nifty, although I seriously have never really felt I needed it with the 200. I think I'd want to install a kicker straight away. Weight savings be damned. XT actually feels taller even though it shouldn't. (Specs say the seat is like 2" shorter.) XT ergonomics feel eerily identical. I was instantly able to get it to crawl around. Clutch is featherlight and awesome, just like my 200. Motor definitely feels like it has a bit more poke to it. I got the front to pop up no problemo. (I haz problems getting it up sometimes.) The pipe is exactly as far up out of the way (comparatively) as it looks like in the photos. (One of my few issues with the 200.)

    I could easily get down with one of these. And that new bike smell is so damned nice.

    One thing I'm curious about is the differences between the linkage on this XT and the KTM PDS system on their "woods" bikes. My 200 XC-W has PDS and I think I may have felt some of the limitations folks talk about with PDS on motocross courses. That said I think the poor 200 is still undersprung for me and I was beating the ever loving crap out of it. In return it beat the hell out of me. In the past I've thoroughly enjoyed it in the woods. I wonder if the XT with its linkage would have been any different. But then I buy the KTM party line that says PDS is the right tool for "woods" use. And that's 98% of what I want. PDS is simpler and easier to work on too. I like that there is no linkage to hang up when sliding things with poor line choice the way I tend to.

    But in the end I'm reminded that my "two hunny" is paid for and does me no wrong. I'm tempted to buy her some right-sized springs, maybe a new (not dinged to hell) pipe and plan a proper service with new bearings and a top-end next winter. I also need to sit down and experiment more with that power valve control.

    Love the one you're with, right? Easy when she's hot and always asks for more.

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  8. #333
    Lifer Imbeek's Avatar
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    Quote Originally Posted by nhbubba View Post
    But in the end I'm reminded that my "two hunny" is paid for and does me no wrong. I'm tempted to buy her some right-sized springs, maybe a new (not dinged to hell) pipe and plan a proper service with new bearings and a top-end next winter. I also need to sit down and experiment more with that power valve control.

    Love the one you're with, right? Easy when she's hot and always asks for more.


    It's not like either of us will be ever lose even half a second of lap time or one iota of enjoyment of dirt riding due to the ktms we are riding vs any other bike...

    I recently resprung both ends of mine. Huge difference for the better for mx use, although I might actually consider temporarily putting the soft stuff back in if I will be doing any hardcore rocky rooty single track with zero whoops and jumps. Need to try my new setup in the rough stuff though, it's possible it's better in the woods than the soft springs.

    I took the advice of factory connection (and racetech) for PDS suspension, and used a progressive spring to replace the straight rate stocker. Feels plush and I don't think I bottomed it despite my best efforts at NHMX.

    You may already know this next part but most mashed 2stroke dirt bike pipes can and do get repaired a few times before discarding, unless you really want a new one. Under a hundred bucks (sometimes WAY under, if you know someone e or just get set up to do it yourself) to have someone heat it, add pressure with air, and make it shaped like new...

    My advice: repair the pipe, and immediately send the suspension to factory connection (hell, you can just drop it off!) for revalve and respring. It's just like PK, but specializing in dirt and very well connected with KTM/WP

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  9. #334
    Lifer
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    I was gonna bump my old "2-stroke for bubs" thread, wherever that went to. But what the hell. This is nesr, why stay on topic?

    I'm somewhat torn. The 200 has always been pretty good to me suspension wise in the woods at clough. Could it be better? I dunno. As you know, late in the day at NHMX course this weekend I threw the KTM in the truck and took out my frickin' DRZ400. This winter I resprung both ends of that (no rebuild/refresh though) trying to pump even more fun into that stupid fun bike. My goal was to get it to handle better on "adventure" street rides and when in sumo mode at track days. But the side effect seems to be that it was pretty darn nice out there on an MX course. Yeah, weird. It plowed every corner and was a bitch to keep in the power (geared waaaaaay wrong!), but it was kinda nice landing the jumps. Probably because the springs were right-sized. Also I have no idea what rates are actually on the KTM. It came to me from a fairly fast NETRA guy who tuned it for himself including having the forks revalved. But he was thinner and younger than I.

    Will I make the bike harsher in the woods with stiffer springs? I hardly ever intend to do MX. Uprating springs because of a rough day doing something I don't actually want the bike to do seems like the wrong move. That said, the bits could probably use a refresh anyway. I paid PK to rebuild and respring the shock on my SV racebike last season and was DELIGHTED at the difference. I love the KTM enough that maybe having a pro shop do the same or similar for the 200 would be a nice treat.

    I also read up about PDS and progressive springs. I'm not sure the spring I have on the machine or any of the (2!) alternates I got with the bike are progressives. All are WP branded springs though.

    And yes, I need to find someone to fix my stock of pipes and/or learn to diy that. PO of the bike told me the freezer and water method works just fine. I have 3 pipes total. (All smashed!!) Experimenting with one has very little downside.

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  10. #335
    Lifer Imbeek's Avatar
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    the only downside to experimenting with pipe repair would be that it's like a little bomb until you get the plugging devices and the way they stay in place dialed in. But that's kinda obvious so as long as you treat it with care and keep some protective barriers in between you and the pipe, should be no biggie. I've heard stories of some pretty dangerous projectiles when the plugs let loose.

    As far as the springs that came with the bike, progressive springs look different...the coils get closer together, or thicker, or both, at one end of the spring, to create the progressive action. I don't recall seeing any available from WP. I bought factory connection's version. If you send stuff to them, they will factor in type of terrain, age, skill level, even your height to all factors, including spring rates, valving, even oil viscosity and volume. Those dudes ain't cheap, and they know their shit. I've talked to the the tech twice since getting mine back and installed on the bike, with questions about which clickers to move in what increments to solve certain feelings I wanted to improve. He was super friendly and helpful both times.

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  11. #336
    Lifer
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    I was going to experiment by freezing the pipe with water in it. That's what the guy I bought the machine from suggested. Said he'd done it with success. I have a big chest freezer available.

    I figured as much re: the springs. Wasn't sure if the one on the bike maybe was compressed a bit (preload collar is just about bottomed out) and just didn't look like it was supposed to. If only the aftermarket does progressives, then maybe it is for sure not.

    I know someone like Factory Connection can do the job for me turn-key. But I wouldn't mind having a hand in it to save a bit of labor. I'm still not sure how important rock-star suspension is for little old me. I'm very bad at tuning clickers and such. Paying for that kind of support is .. well, not going to get utilized very well.
    I know several other suspension tuners in the area will do dirty bike suspension without the premium. Using one of them turn-key to get some kind of baseline may be a happy medium.

    In the interest of making some connection to this thread: This seems like the benefit of something "softer" like this XT. You get detuned not-race suspension settings meant for the masses, not the experts. That the engine is tuned likewise makes this thing a really cool package. My only beef (and this applies to all premium motorcycles) is that spring sizing is not included with the sale price. At this kind of price it seems to me it should. Or for a small premium immediately post sale. Likely not an issue for many normal sized humans. But for me.

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  12. #337
    Lifer Imbeek's Avatar
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    I thought my preload collar was bottomed out too...turns out the collar has skirt material that hangs past its threads, if that makes any sense, so it looks like it's nearing the end but it's really not. Following the manual's method (and factory connections recommendations), you measure the spring uninstalled, then apply just a very small mm preload (maybe 4 or 5, if I remember correctly?) to it as a starting point. When I did this, I realized that my "almost bottomed out" looking preload collar with my old too soft spring only had about 15mm of preload on it, but that's too much. I could've put a bunch more too much on it, using the hidden threads. Would've made it worse, though.

    Translation: not sure why ktm shocks appear to have about 3" of unnecessary thread on them, seemingly in the wrong area, but don't use it as an indicator of incorrect spring rate.

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  13. #338
    Soul Rider Paul_E_D's Avatar
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    The KTM PDS springs are all progressive wound. Bubs, Absolutely get the correct springs. It will not make it harsher. Too soft actually feels harsher because the bike won't float over ANYthing.

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  14. #339
    Don't bother me! R7's Avatar
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    My wait is almost over, my new XTrainer will be ready in 2 weeks

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  15. #340
    Development Rider scottieducati's Avatar
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    Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    So after riding NHMX on my 100% stock Beta XT, I can offer a few insights...

    She was entirely predictable and user friendly from my first session to my last. At ~205 lbs, I'm surely at least 40-50 lbs heavy for the "stock" springs on my XT. Even at that, I felt no hard bottoming the entire event. Off the larger jumps that I had the cajones to try, I'd often get a soft landing and a "bunny hop" afterwards. I never tried playing with rebound damping or spring settings to combat this, it felt rather natural and at no point did it seem to upset the bike.

    On Friday when the track was mint, I felt the most comfortable. Spinning the rear through the berms and backing it in under braking felt pretty calm and collected. It was only on Saturday when the "whoops" in the braking areas began to show that the soft suspension really started to show its limitations.

    I've said it before and I'll say it again, I am utterly impressed by the fact this bike has allowed me to take my first forays into off road riding first with a mix of woods and MX with Paul, then trails and power lines with Tom, then Stimilon at NHMX. The bike may not have been "dialed" for any of these, but it allowed me to feel comfortable doing any and everything I asked of it. At NHMX, the limitation was really just not being able to carry more speed in certain areas as the track got chewed up a bit and I think this was felt by many who weren't on super-dialed MX bikes. Of course, the lack of carrying more speed is also directly related to my lack of willingness to say "f*ck it" and twist the throttle more.

    Bottom line is, some schlep who has never ridden dirt at all, has now ridden in 3 different environments with much success and never once did I feel like the bike wasn't capable of what I was asking of it. In fact, I am 100% sure that the combination of 300cc's, super-friendly power, a soft but compliant suspension that resists bottoming, and the general make-up of this bike is a huge reason why I've been able to dip my feet into this whole dirt thing and have not once felt frustrated or defeated (at least not by the bike). My fitness is the only thing holding me back at this point. I think I will be looking into getting stiffer springs and eventually playing with some of the rebound damping and tire combos, but I see nothing that would prevent me from coming back to NHMX and continuing to improve and get faster before I reach the true limits of the bike.

    And despite some preferences for a kicker, it was pretty awesome when picking up my bike to just hop on, hit a button and keep going. Especially when it was god-awful hot out there. It felt like cheating at the start gate sitting next to someone who musta kicked their bike 15 times before it fired up, you could tell he was outta breath. Not what I want to be feeling waiting for the gate to drop.

    All that said, man would I love to take Clinton's 250RR out for a sesh.... but he loves it so, no man could pry it from his hands.

    Proof:

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    Last edited by scottieducati; 05-31-16 at 12:19 PM.

    CCS/LRRS #83

  16. #341
    Day late, dollar short carsick's Avatar
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    I can't believe I missed the chance to check out that bike in person. I'm not worthy, but I'd still hit it if given a chance.

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  17. #342
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    Quote Originally Posted by scottieducati View Post
    All that said, man would I love to take Clinton's 250RR out for a sesh.... but he loves it so, no man could pry it from his hands.
    sorry, man. i didn't even think to offer a ride around the pits at the very least. next time. definitely curious how she compares to your XT. Sunday would have been a good day to jam around the track but i didn't have time to stick around too long.

    pumped you made it out, good to finally meet you.

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    Beta 200RR

  18. #343
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro-v__dfb2-jpg

    Getting close..

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  19. #344
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    i may get to fondle it before you do Dave has a set of plastics for me, they're hitching a ride half way.

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    Beta 200RR

  20. #345
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    I saw that pic from Dave on the faceyspace and wondered if it might be yours....

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  21. #346
    Lifer typeone's Avatar
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    scottie, did you ever get your MA ORV sticker sorted out?

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    Beta 200RR

  22. #347
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    Nope, not yet. Dave supposedly has someone working on getting his MA Dealer License / Number thing worked out but it hasn't yet. A few folks had success using his business' EIN and I may go that route....

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  23. #348
    Don't bother me! R7's Avatar
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    Quote Originally Posted by typeone View Post
    i may get to fondle it before you do Dave has a set of plastics for me, they're hitching a ride half way.
    Easy on it, I like virgins..lol

    Dave is proving to be top notch in my book, great communication, and he's delivering the bike to my house

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  24. #349
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    Quote Originally Posted by scottieducati View Post
    Nope, not yet. Dave supposedly has someone working on getting his MA Dealer License / Number thing worked out but it hasn't yet. A few folks had success using his business' EIN and I may go that route....
    damn, that sucks. that means my neighbor will have same issue, he bought a 300RR off Dave.

    Quote Originally Posted by R7 View Post
    Easy on it, I like virgins..lol

    Dave is proving to be top notch in my book, great communication, and he's delivering the bike to my house
    that's great to hear, someone is psyched this afternoon can't wait for the first report! ...and pics

    sadly, i wont get to stretch that vestal tailpipe, meeting up after your delivery.

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    Beta 200RR

  25. #350
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    Re: Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro

    Beta Xtrainer - Entry level 300cc 2T Enduro-imag00958-jpg

    No real report, I just took it for a 2 mile putt putt around the property...all smiles so far. Its a torque monster

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