LRRS championships clinched?

[Doc]

bump to AM and lets find out

Emailing Don...

[Doc]

Oxx, welcome to last week. Doc already pointed that out.

Another wonderful move by LRRS. Now even LESS people will move up when they are eligible.

Congrats to all amateur championship winners!!

derek

Aww come on Degs... It is just a title. I think everyone knows it doesn't mean as much as an expert title. (although it is an AWESOME achievement)

[13]

Oxx, welcome to last week. Doc already pointed that out.

Another wonderful move by LRRS. Now even LESS people will move up when they are eligible.

Congrats to all amateur championship winners!!

derek

I knew at the last riders meeting they were having the achievement awards, they announced it. I just started this thread to see how many NESR members had earned a TITLE of some sort. I said championship, but I guess I shouldn't have. It was never meant to get people mad, or start fighting.

I'm eligible to move up, but I'm gonna wait it out one weekend until next season. Title or not, I was planning to do that. I don't think anyone can complain about that......

[Doc]

So If I bump for the last race weekend I can race with you?!! and OXX


Hmmm....??? :think:

[nt650hawk]

O6 on the LRRS web site it also said Champion. If it was like last year it will be the achievement again this year. You all are champions in my mind. If that counts for anything?

[Puppet]

You all are champions in my mind. If that counts for anything?

Awww...Gino....

[OreoGaborio]

Another wonderful move by LRRS. Now even LESS people will move up when they are eligible.

Congrats to all amateur championship winners!!

derek

To be fair, this is far from the case in some classes.

Production twins for example... I don't think any of us that are in contention for the championship are eligible to bump to expert, INCLUDING the guy who's gonna get it, Jonathan Vaughan. Clayton, nor Charlie Tarna, nor Tom Joyce, nor Conor Joyce, nor myself are eligible to bump to expert based on number of races completed and index alone.

I'm sure PTwins isn't the only example of this.

So although i understand the whole "you're not competing against the best am's cuz they bump to expert" theory, it's not a universal truth.

This is why I get a bug up my ass when people stare down their noses at the Amateur Championship. Some people actually fuckin earn it the right way and compete against the best riders in the Amateur class for the entire season. Not every fast amateur is eligible for advancment 1/2 way through the season, thus not every Amateur Champion is a cherry picker.

Jonathan Vaughan earned his Am PTwins Championship by racing against the very best AM Ptwins racers from week 1 to week 7 and will do so again during week 8.

[BMFR6]

I understand what you are saying Pete....... but PTwins is unique I think. I'm willing to bet that in any other class you look at, there are people eligble to bump up that consistiently finish in the top 5. I could look at the am advancement sheet right now and probably see 10-15 people (couple different classes) that i race with on SV's that are eligble to bump up (myself included).

[jamotech741]

my 2 cents, amateur championship is no more than the fastest of the slower guys championship. Most people that win it are cherry picking anyway and are plenty fast enough to compete with experts. Fuck amateur championship, if I was fast enough to win an amateur championship I wouldnt be an amateur. Jamie knows what im talking about, if him and I were consistently fast enough to win the amateur races, which are won at a 15-16 pace we would be experts already. I guess some of us are looking at the bigger picture when some people would rather dominate the slow guy group for the rest of their lives. Just my opinion.

And as far as experts looking down on am/nv. You can thank eric sampson for that, but mostly to blame are the am/nv that are in need of a serious reality check. Some of these guys/girls think they are going to be the next ama superstar, they carry that attitude on and off the track while not having a fraction of skill that actual pros do. The reality is a lot of top level guys started as experts in club racing and dominated from the start, as experts. Eric sampson bragged about his am champs like they were the first step to his stardom. Reality check, look at shane, jeff, eric, they do average in ama competition. So until you can beat any of them dont try and push me off the track or clip my front tire passing because you think your ben spies in the making. Trust me your not. This is why Jerry has to constantly remind riders that "were racing for plastic trophies here people". This isnt opinion just common sense

[OreoGaborio]

my 2 cents, amateur championship is no more than the fastest of the slower guys championship. Most people that win it are cherry picking anyway and are plenty fast enough to compete with experts. Fuck amateur championship, if I was fast enough to win an amateur championship I wouldnt be an amateur. Jamie knows what im talking about, if him and I were consistently fast enough to win the amateur races, which are won at a 15-16 pace we would be experts already. I guess some of us are looking at the bigger picture when some people would rather dominate the slow guy group for the rest of their lives. Just my opinion.

And as far as experts looking down on am/nv. You can thank eric sampson for that, but mostly to blame are the am/nv that are in need of a serious reality check. Some of these guys/girls think they are going to be the next ama superstar, they carry that attitude on and off the track while not having a fraction of skill that actual pros do. The reality is a lot of top level guys started as experts in club racing and dominated from the start, as experts. Eric sampson bragged about his am champs like they were the first step to his stardom. Reality check, look at shane, jeff, eric, they do average in ama competition. So until you can beat any of them dont try and push me off the track or clip my front tire passing because you think your ben spies in the making. Trust me your not. This is why Jerry has to constantly remind riders that "were racing for plastic trophies here people". This isnt opinion just common sense

This is exactly why i love the lightweight classes... It doesn't make you bitter at everyone else cuz there's not NEARLY as many cherry pickers & jackasses out on the track that don't know what the fuck they're doing.

[Kitt]

doc where do you find season points for novice classes?

[BLACK SQUIRREL]

my 2 cents, amateur championship is no more than the fastest of the slower guys championship. Most people that win it are cherry picking anyway and are plenty fast enough to compete with experts. Fuck amateur championship, if I was fast enough to win an amateur championship I wouldnt be an amateur. Jamie knows what im talking about, if him and I were consistently fast enough to win the amateur races, which are won at a 15-16 pace we would be experts already. I guess some of us are looking at the bigger picture when some people would rather dominate the slow guy group for the rest of their lives. Just my opinion.

And as far as experts looking down on am/nv. You can thank eric sampson for that, but mostly to blame are the am/nv that are in need of a serious reality check. Some of these guys/girls think they are going to be the next ama superstar, they carry that attitude on and off the track while not having a fraction of skill that actual pros do. The reality is a lot of top level guys started as experts in club racing and dominated from the start, as experts. Eric sampson bragged about his am champs like they were the first step to his stardom. Reality check, look at shane, jeff, eric, they do average in ama competition. So until you can beat any of them dont try and push me off the track or clip my front tire passing because you think your ben spies in the making. Trust me your not. This is why Jerry has to constantly remind riders that "were racing for plastic trophies here people". This isnt opinion just common sense

Racing is supposed to be fun

[nt650hawk]

Most people that win it are cherry picking anyway and are plenty fast enough to compete with experts

I guess My first race as an AM I was cherry picking. That would have been my 11 race ever. Maybe I should have just jumped right into the EX class right from Novice.

[smf]

This is exactly why i love the lightweight classes... It doesn't make you bitter at everyone else cuz there's not NEARLY as many cherry pickers & jackasses out on the track that don't know what the fuck they're doing.

+1. i honestly don't understand why ppl want to compete in the bigger classes. seeing the way some ppl race in them it looks a lot more hazardous than fun.

[BLACK SQUIRREL]

+1. i honestly don't understand why ppl want to compete in the bigger classes. seeing the way some ppl race in them it looks a lot more hazardous than fun.

+3 Best racing choice I ever Made

[Awesome]

+1. i honestly don't understand why ppl want to compete in the bigger classes. seeing the way some ppl race in them it looks a lot more hazardous than fun.

Ever raced in a bigger class? Didn't think so.

[Crash Dummy Denno]

+1. i honestly don't understand why ppl want to compete in the bigger classes. seeing the way some ppl race in them it looks a lot more hazardous than fun.

I thought riders were better as you move up?

[BLACK SQUIRREL]

I thought riders were better as you move up?

No thats not it. the smaller bikes are cheaper to run, you get to use more of the bikes power. they are lighter and are more focused on cornerspeed then outright horspower.

I have race both ultralight, and Middleweight. and I am not gonna say one might be better then another for someone else. but i am starting kinda late mid 30's and i find the middleweight grids to be a bit large and crazy(novice that is) if I were a younger Man I would not hesitate to do middleweight. I raced a 600 in florida homestead that was a blast but loudon is a diffrent story.

I think a lot of the confusion is the amount of races. a 600 middlewieght can i think 6-7 races a weekend a be competitive. you can bump up in 1.5 weekends if you do well. in ultralight and Ptwins you have 1 race a weekend that is you focus event and maybe 1or 2 more that you can enter and maybe be competive. in AM and expert even less so as the lw bikes are tuned more and quite faster.

Stupidhawk who started this post rides a basicly stock ultralight Hawk GT pushing @55 hp =/- which makes competive in 1 race a weekend racing against guys whose bike is competive in 1 rce per weekend.If you look at it that way you could not even bump in a season. he has raced agaist the same people everyweekend who are not elegble either.

my .02

Chris is a Champ

[Paul_E_D]

Congrats to all the champs.

All I can say about the amatuer champs is that I think it's a good thing. It's fun, and provides some purpose to racing in the early years. It certainly makes it more fun. and if you do well, it indicates potential.

What it has in common with an expert championship... zero. In general, it takes an entirely different skillset to win consistently against top expert racers who are going for the points as well. Occasionally, a class will lack talent, but it's pretty rare these days as most top riders look at the classes and pick some that they can win. This spreads the talent pretty evenly. If you win at this level, I tip my hat to you. It's a really huge accomplishment.

[Pittenger5]

I think the moral of this whole story is that its something for the individual to be proud of. Its not like they're gonna be offered a factory ride cause they told someone they were an amateur champion at loudon, and the person mistook it for something else. I didnt even come close to winning an amateur champion, especially since Im only a novice, but theres a whole lot of things about this race season that I'm proud of, and thats what I matter. If you didnt have something to be proud of after a season of racing you should probably just quit.

[jamotech741]

I guess My first race as an AM I was cherry picking. That would have been my 11 race ever. Maybe I should have just jumped right into the EX class right from Novice.

Key word was "most" and if you finish each race 3-4 seconds a lap faster than everyone else then you were most certainly cherry picking. Im all about an even field to make great all around competition, which is why I dont watch ama superbike races anymore. I have all the respect in the world for Nicky Hayden taking a pay cut to go to moto gp, seemed to work out well for him. I have no respect for matt mladin, all that talent but the money suzuki paid him to be in ama was worth more than taking the chance of going to the world level. I hope he truly regrets not puting himself into the world level of racing and thinks of himself as a cherry picker that was too scared to go up against people as good as him and actually challenge himself.

[Ken C]

AM Champs should be proud. It's a great achievement. I am still proud of my two Acheivement awards (before they were championships).

That said, I probably wouldn't get closer than faster top 6 if I stayed racing. The fast experts have no place to go from Expert and have been racing for many years. You can't expect to compete with them for many seasons until you learn the secrets they know. So, winning a championship as an Expert is by far a greater acheivement. I think we all agree on that.

Congrats AM Champs!

[Degsy]

Some great replies here. I thunk we're all basically on the same page. Good point Pete, there are a few classes where it's very tough to move up.

...and I was being sincere when I said congrats to all the amateur champs. I didn't realize that LRRS was having an amateur championship this year, now I do. However, just because it says it on the website doesn't make it so. Just be aware you might be unpleasantly surprised at the banquet.

derek

[RyanNicholson]

yea i mean, i'll agree w/ jamotech for the overall "larger picture" outlook for middleweight racers....but i dont have a problem with the am championships, because they are what they are. i never really thought of it from the LW perspective (i know nothing about it) but it makes sense from what mongoose said. its just a weird situation overall.

as far as MW classes being hazardous, the main reason of that is new racers in the novice class that come off the street on their 600 and are in way over their head. shit happens on any bike, but i think if you keep your head on straight in any class you'll be ok. i've crashed a good amount (not something i'm proud of) but i've also never taken anybody out, and i've only been taken out once. its just the closing speeds and stuff that makes it scary in the novice class, once you bump to AM its way better, and expert even more so.

its true sampson bragged about his AM championships like they were AMA titles....you can read his myspace page to see that, its pretty obnoxious. i think hes a rare case, and his reputation at the track paid for it. i'm sure 99% of the people out there that win am champs will be proud of it (and should be!), but also will understand what it means in the big picture.

[Doc]

The fast experts have no place to go from Expert and have been racing for many years. You can't expect to compete with them for many seasons until you learn the secrets they know. So, winning a championship as an Expert is by far a greater acheivement. I think we all agree on that.
Congrats AM Champs!

Maybe we should haxe an Ultra Expert class?