NHMS 2012 Suggestions?

[PainfullySlow]

For the team endurance race I was thinking something along the lines of EX takes the starts, runs 20 (or however many) laps. At the end of their 20 they pit in and the AMs come out. When AMs run their 20, the NV get out..this way the worst that is on the track together is EX and AM, or AM and NV. I thought that should buffer the speed differential a bit.

We could have individual entries and have a random drawing for teams (if you want this to just be good fun for a good cause) or people could stack their teams themselves.

I have no idea how much interest there would be into such a thing however...

[a13x]

Like to see the Sept LRRS race not conflict with the NJMP AMA race. Be cool to get more of the LRRS guys racing DSB/SS

[Awesome]

For the team endurance race I was thinking something along the lines of EX takes the starts, runs 20 (or however many) laps. At the end of their 20 they pit in and the AMs come out. When AMs run their 20, the NV get out..this way the worst that is on the track together is EX and AM, or AM and NV. I thought that should buffer the speed differential a bit.

We could have individual entries and have a random drawing for teams (if you want this to just be good fun for a good cause) or people could stack their teams themselves.

I have no idea how much interest there would be into such a thing however...

How is it an endurance race if it is stop and start? And if everyone does a set number of laps? The endurance races are run and scored by number of laps and don't often come down to timing.
Would you let any name drawn out of a hat race on your bike?
There are already rules and organization in existance by the sanctioning racing org, don't attempt to re-invent the wheel.

[PainfullySlow]

Obviously I am not conveying my idea properly and it is definitely more of a "relay" race than an endurance race per se that I have in mind. I am well aware that there are already regulations on an endurance race and no, I wouldnt let someone else ride on my bike which I think is probably a major factor prohibiting signups.

What I had in mind was where everyone rides their own bike. One rider comes in, swaps their armband to their teammate, and then the new rider with the armband takes off on their own bike. As I said, it is just a suggestion on something new and possibly interesting to do, take it or leave it.

All I know is that there is a large gap in the community of racers at LRRS between the ranks and doing something fun like this might help to bridge them. I am only just now meeting some of the experts and it is only because I just started riding with them. A year ago I would never have considered going up and talking to any of them and I dont believe that I am alone in this thinking. Stronger community = stronger sport for all.

[butcher bergs]

White line in 1 - I've never had an issue. If you're talking about turn 1a, that one has been addressed by using a new product that has grip.

Was only mentioning it as a result of the issues that arise particularly at the beginning of the season for the last 2 seasons.

[daviid]

drop novice.

follow the ccs rule book & class structure

[Jim]

i had 8 people come watch the races this weekend. I had to suggest them to go Sunday, because I know they wouldn't pay $25 to watch a few races on Saturday.

[darkduc7]

This

.

3. Any Racer that Pre-Enters at least "2" races, should get free Gate Fee for the weekend. Any Racer that Pre-Enters at least "4" races, should get a free Gate Fee for a Guest.

and this

For the team endurance race I was thinking something along the lines of EX takes the starts, runs 20 (or however many) laps. At the end of their 20 they pit in and the AMs come out. When AMs run their 20, the NV get out..this way the worst that is on the track together is EX and AM, or AM and NV. I thought that should buffer the speed differential a bit.

We could have individual entries and have a random drawing for teams (if you want this to just be good fun for a good cause) or people could stack their teams themselves.

I have no idea how much interest there would be into such a thing however...

[Doc]

drop novice.

follow the ccs rule book & class structure

That would certainly fill grids and open up some track for the Lightweight Thunderbike type stuff.

It is a valid thought. Although I don't agree with it.

As for my input... I have love seeing the improvements to the track, the new small stone gravel is awesome. A new track would be neat but a resurfacing of the track is pretty overdue and would be nice.
That said it might pick up the pace a bit so we might look into the safety aspect more if there is going to be a repaving.

Cheaper racing is important. I know the Proddy Twins class is cheap but it isn't "cool". Make a cheap "cool" class and I think there will be more riders. Also ADVERTISING. There are ALOT of sportbike riders in the area that have NO CLUE there is a road racing course or a Racing Series in New England.

Smarter people than me can figure out the scheduling and determine which classes are the most important. Just don't let damn Superbike SV's into ULSB

[ThunderCycle]

A couple of ideas:

1. During the Classic have an information booth for visitors. It would allow us to promote the sport and answer any questions our guests might have. I noticed all of the racers were more than accommodating to anyone walking through the garages, but some people may not feel comfortable interrupting a racer getting geared up.
A similar set up at some of the regional motorcycle nights might work well. We could explain racing, track days, show our gear and maybe a couple of bikes. We might convert some of the "fence sitters" to race and a few more fans to come watch.

2. P.A. in turn 6. I watched a few races up there and it's a pretty knowledgeable fan base in 6. We have a great announcer and it would be nice to share his knowledge with our fan base.

[Boosh]

As for the LRRS series I realize that we are up against a schedule already but if it is possible I would love to see a team relay/endurance race? I dont know if there is a technical term for it but I have seen AFAM do it. Multiple riders take turns out in the same race, swapping an armband in hot pits so that only 1 rider from the team is out at a time? I realize that this probably isnt possible for a regular event but perhaps as a once a year, charity, or special occasion thing? As a twist make it 3 members: 1 EX, 1AM, 1NV, almost like a "sponsor a racer"/mentoring kind of thing? If nothing else it would help to bring the different social circles together and I am sure that the less experienced riders would benefit from a chat with some of the fast guys. This may turn out to be a logistical nightmare but if possible I would volunteer my time to help with it, I have several more ideas along this same line.

All for the team relay I think it would be a GREAT idea.

The T10 bump love to see that go away ! as well as the bump on the exit of T12

[Doc]

as well as the bump on the exit of T12

You mean the turtle?

[b0xmonkey]

A couple of ideas:


2. P.A. in turn 6. I watched a few races up there and it's a pretty knowledgeable fan base in 6. We have a great announcer and it would be nice to share his knowledge with our fan base.

That's a good one, I watched a couple of races from the bowl and was thinking it would be nice if I could hear the announcer. Maybe while they are fixing the rest of the PA that would be an easy fix?

[CBR929RE]

I don't understand how the amount of gas used matters, or when riders decide to take their pits stops? Endurance races are run everywhere with AM and Ex on the track at the same time. Historically novice is considered AM. I did the race as a novice with one other novice and an expert and I think we placed 2nd or 3rd overall.

well amount of gas would matter when its one factor in determining when to do a pit stop.

I was just thinking that its a bad idea to have a novice running say 1:35s on track with experts going 20+ seconds a lap faster. with the right people it wouldn't matter as I know of a few current novices who would be just fine with being passed by the experts. but I don't wanna exclude anyone from the race simply because they are slow. I just think the details would need to be thought through.

For the team endurance race I was thinking something along the lines of EX takes the starts, runs 20 (or however many) laps. At the end of their 20 they pit in and the AMs come out. When AMs run their 20, the NV get out..this way the worst that is on the track together is EX and AM, or AM and NV. I thought that should buffer the speed differential a bit.

We could have individual entries and have a random drawing for teams (if you want this to just be good fun for a good cause) or people could stack their teams themselves.

I have no idea how much interest there would be into such a thing however...

only problem is everyone is gonna be doing their 20 laps in a different amount of time so you'd end up with NVs still being out while some EX are heading out. kind of defeats the purpose of trying to separate them.

I still kind of like the idea of it just being a more regular type endurance race. a group of friends get together and make a team. I think one of each rank would make it pretty interesting. I think one solution to the nv/ex passing could be anyone not comfortable with a close pass could put a big X on their back just like they do in the Friday Penguin practices. wouldn't be a big deal having an EX take a little extra time going around a slower rider since its an endurance.

[The Snowman]

I believe there should be some serious consideration for a cash related race for lightweight bikes. (including motards, and ultra lightweight bikes) This would be for those motorcycles that aren't competitive with middleweight and heavyweight bikes.

Pay similar to the dash for cash: cash prizes for the first 8 experts and the first place amateur.

[Rambunctous]

New Racer Mentor Program. Just someone willing to help a newcomer on Friday and Saturday with where to be and when, grid sheet, where is tech, leave the track stuff to the Penquin people. I have sent Emails off but not a single response.

[Woodcraft]

drop novice.

follow the ccs rule book & class structure

I am a definite proponent of the Novice class. In order for this sport to grow there needs to be a place for new guys to try this sport out in a comfortable environment. When you only have Amatuer and Expert, there are always combined classes. Ricky Doucette can do 1:14's on a LW bike. We had Novices this weekend in the 1:30's and 1:40's. If they were Amatuers, they would be on track with guys like Ricky.....bad for them and bad for the fast guys as well. Removing this horror show where these guys would get lapped twice in an 8 lap race, is worth whatever time it takes in the schedule in my opinion. What we do is both safer and more enjoyable for everyone. I honestly think that CCS could take a look at what we are doing and make it nationwide.

For following the CCS rulebook - we mostly do. We make one change in the ULSB class in that we don't allow SV's - since we have plenty of extra classes for them that other regions don't. Because Loudon is small, we have WAY more LW bikes than anywhere else in the nation....so we cater to them. I think that this is a good idea.

[PainfullySlow]

New Racer Mentor Program. Just someone willing to help a newcomer on Friday and Saturday with where to be and when, grid sheet, where is tech, leave the track stuff to the Penquin people. I have sent Emails off but not a single response.

This is a great idea and I would be all for it.

[rolker]

Cheaper racing is important. I know the Proddy Twins class is cheap but it isn't "cool". Make a cheap "cool" class and I think there will be more riders.

Shubie, in Nova Scotia has a smaller racing community than here and they are seeing shrinking grids as well, but during my yearly visit a few weeks ago I was surprised at how popular their Mini Road Racing class was and how much it has grown since last year. It is geared towards young new racers on a budget so only stock street bikes 250CC and under are allowed. Most riders there are on CBR125's so they can compete in the national CBR125 series they have in Canada.

They allow EX/AM to race in this class, but they get gridded in the back and their points don't count. I think this is an excellent idea. The experienced racers go in with an attitude that they are helping out future racers, so they ride in a way that shows the young kids how to pass cleanly without putting anyone in danger.

Now, would racing EX250s at Loudon be fun? I think so, but you can also ask the two racers (KB and Jake) that took my EX250 out on the track at yesterday's track day and came back in with huge grins...

[SVRACER01]

Cheaper racing is important. I know the Proddy Twins class is cheap but it isn't "cool". Make a cheap "cool" class and I think there will be more riders.

there already is....MWPT.

[daviid]

I am a definite proponent of the Novice class. In order for this sport to grow there needs to be a place for new guys to try this sport out in a comfortable environment. When you only have Amatuer and Expert, there are always combined classes. Ricky Doucette can do 1:14's on a LW bike. We had Novices this weekend in the 1:30's and 1:40's. If they were Amatuers, they would be on track with guys like Ricky.....bad for them and bad for the fast guys as well. Removing this horror show where these guys would get lapped twice in an 8 lap race, is worth whatever time it takes in the schedule in my opinion. What we do is both safer and more enjoyable for everyone. I honestly think that CCS could take a look at what we are doing and make it nationwide.

wera does it best imho. you have provisional novices that have to wear a neon shirt. after you make it 2 weekends, off comes the shirt. right now in the current economy, the grids just dont justify having a 3 tier structure. if you were having 40-60 bikes per race, then yes. but when grids are small enough that race winners cannot collect contingency its unjustifiable. and as someone who is slow as shit, if someone is uncomfortable by being on a race track with faster riders, they should probably reevaluate their newly found hobby.

For following the CCS rulebook - we mostly do. We make one change in the ULSB class in that we don't allow SV's - since we have plenty of extra classes for them that other regions don't. Because Loudon is small, we have WAY more LW bikes than anywhere else in the nation....so we cater to them. I think that this is a good idea.

that is one of a few things i could pick out of the rulebook. belly pans is my biggest complaint. it seems everytime the belly pan issue pops up the ptwins mafia & motards get their panties in a bunch.

the last thing i can come up with, make a rotating schedule. right now you have guys who are stuck waiting till the end of sunday to race. you can come up with 3 or 4 "stock" schedules and switch them up.

[Jim]

David,
When is the last time you rode at NHMS ? You're making more complaints than anyone, and stopped racing at LRRS events a few years ago.

The only safe way of eliminating NV, would probably require EX and AM to split up in separate races. Even then, some AM guys are doing 1:17 and better. Not really smart when there are 1st time riders in NV doing 1:35 and slower.

[SVRACER01]

my biggest (and probably only) safety complaint

[rant/]the belly pan rule is a losing battle. ive been complaining about it since i started racing there. it makes you wonder if the oil that was dumped on the track by the motard blowing up couldve been prevented with a "belly pan" of sorts.

the rules clearly state that all 4 stroke motorcycles need a bellypan capable of holding at least 3 quarts. but then exceptions are given. at first the excuse was "EXs dont blow up" does it have a motor? yes? then it can blow up. and someone can most certainly forget to tighten a drain plug or filler cap and forget to safety wire it.. "motards only hold 1 QT" i guess i didnt realize that oil can only cause a crash if its more than a Qt. theres always talk of safety like more airfence and i, like many, greatly appreciate it. but why not enforce a rule that was so obviously designed around safety? LRRS already requires more safety wiring than CCS does for safety reasons, why not the belly pan? [endrant/]

[daviid]

David,
When is the last time you rode at NHMS ? You're making more complaints than anyone, and stopped racing at LRRS events a few years ago.

The only safe way of eliminating NV, would probably require EX and AM to split up in separate races. Even then, some AM guys are doing 1:17 and better. Not really smart when there are 1st time riders in NV doing 1:35 and slower.

the last time i rode NHMS was in October and decided the track condition is crap and made it known i wouldnt race on it till its fixed. if that means i never race there again, so be it, but that doesnt mean I don't want to see the series turn for the worse. I rather see it come up to par with other organizations and make it worth while for a guy to drive 10 hours for. There is something to be said when people bypass closer tracks to attend farther away ones.

alot of people here have only raced lrrs and that is all they know. im bringing my opinions from my time spent with ccs & wera. there are things that I think lrrs does better then CCS. Tech & Registration are 2 of the things i can come up with. But im not going to comment on them if i think they are fine in a thread about improvements.

[SVRACER01]

David,
When is the last time you rode at NHMS ? You're making more complaints than anyone, and stopped racing at LRRS events a few years ago.

The only safe way of eliminating NV, would probably require EX and AM to split up in separate races. Even then, some AM guys are doing 1:17 and better. Not really smart when I'm in NV doing 1:35 and slower.

i like the idea of the NV class, but i didnt think that full lineup was necessary for them. i think LRRS has moved in the right direction this year by making it what it should be which is an entry level class to get your feet wet and see if its really for you. im not sure that eliminating it completely is the way to go though.

ive never raced WERA and i find it hard to believe that someone whose NEVER raced before would start in WERA, so having a preliminary "shirt time" probably works just fine for them.